Phaedrus

    Socrates: (cont.) for just as they lead hungry goats by holding out and shaking a young shoot or some fruit

    // 230δ

    ὥσπερ γὰρ οἱ τὰ πεινῶντα θρέμματα θαλλὸν ἤ τινα καρπὸν προσείοντες ἄγουσιν

    //

    Socrates: (cont.) you however seem to me to have found the drug (pharmakon) of my exodus

    // 230δ

    σὺ μέντοι δοκεῖς μοι τῆς ἐμῆς ἐξόδου τὸ φάρμακον ηὑρηκέναι

    //

    Socrates: (cont.) unlike the humans in the city

    // 230δ

    οἱ δ᾽ ἐν τῷ ἄστει ἄνθρωποι

    //

    consistere

    psst — the monsters are all in evidence over here
    many with their sights on you, can you not see them?
    maybe they don’t wear chaos like your command
    or ugliness as your specification; maybe in love
    they can’t afford to show the truth; some have been known
    to flatter relentlessly the passing beauty; or even
    to dress up as their own negation, pretending tools
    or fancy chairs or helpless little girls; and many
    renouncing love or beauty altogether; but nobody
    is sorry; nobody knows that everybody
    is swallowed up by someone by the end; and nobody
    is more monstrous than mercy, or more self-same

    still; if you want it darker, we can totally kill the flame
    but the poet will kill it for us in six or seven lines

    //

    xox

    Socrates: (cont.) now then the spaces (chorion) and the trees are not at all willing to teach me

    // 230δ

    τὰ μὲν οὖν χωρία καὶ τὰ δένδρα οὐδέν μ᾽ ἐθέλει διδάσκειν

    //

    Socrates: (cont.) for i am a lover of learning (philomathes)

    // 230δ

    φιλομαθὴς γάρ εἰμι

    //

    Love here is philos rather than eros; philomathes (from philos + manthanein) could be either an adjective or a verb, rendering alternative translations,

    for i am a lover of learning
    for i am (you) love learning

    like a Socratic Tetragrammaton.

    This is the speech, written by Lysias, that Phaedrus is about to read; Phaedrus also references Socrates' special interest in erotics (e.g. Symposium 177d).

    There’s a notable comparison between suggignoskein (to think together) and charizein (to gratify), whose meanings could somehow overlap (to agree with, to forgive, to share a feeling); whereas Socrates (lover?) asks for the first, Lysias' speech will be about the latter (for a non-lover).

    The sheer amount left implicit in the conversation about love (and desire, and sexuality, as subject to persuasion, as coercion, as predatory, as abuse, in a culture of abuse, etc. etc., as experiment, as play, as care, as friendship, as sacred, as true) (and as poetry) really baffled me when i first encountered the dialogue (>25 years ago). But if Phaedrus has a unifying theme, perhaps it would be this — the power of the unspoken.

    //

    Socrates: think together with me (suggignosko), O best one

    // 230δ

    συγγίγνωσκέ μοι, ὦ ἄριστε

    //

    suggignosko, from sun (together) + gignosko (to be aware of, perceive, observe, know, learn, discern, observe, judge, determine, think, know carnally, have sex with), carries a variety of implications, to think with or agree with, also to acknowledge, to confess, to make allowances for, to forgive, etc., similar to Latin conscience; many possible meanings here, intimacy implied —

    think together with me
    agree with me
    share thoughts with me
    acknowledge me
    learn with me
    observe with me
    confess to me
    share a feeling with me
    understand me
    recognize me
    forgive me
    know me
    know me together

    //

    basically a marriage proposal

    Phaedrus: (cont.) so to me you seem someone never let out of the city, going neither out and abroad, nor outside the wall

    // 230δ

    οὕτως ἐκ τοῦ ἄστεος οὔτ᾽ εἰς τὴν ὑπερορίαν ἀποδημεῖς οὔτ᾽ ἔξω τείχους ἔμοιγε δοκεῖς τὸ παράπαν ἐξιέναι

    //

    Phaedrus: (cont.) for artlessly (a-technos), as you say, you have looked like some guided stranger and not of the country

    // 230ξ

    ἀτεχνῶς γάρ ὃ λέγεις ξεναγουμένῳ τινὶ καὶ οὐκ ἐπιχωρίῳ ἔοικας

    //

    Phaedrus: (cont.) appear someone most placeless

    // 230ξ

    ἀτοπώτατός τις φαίνῃ

    //

    Phaedrus: but you, O wondrous one

    // 230ξ

    σὺ δέ γε, ὦ θαυμάσιε

    //

    Socrates: by Hera, it is a beautiful resting place

    this platanos tree is hugely wide-spreading (amphilaphes) and high (uphelos); and of the chaste tree, the height and the dense shade are entirely beautiful; and as she holds on (echein) to the cusp (akme) of her full bloom, she supplies such a sweet-smelling place; and also the graceful stream is flowing under the platanos tree with exceedingly cool water, by the witness (tekmairomai) of my foot

    and by the girls and the statues it seems to be the temple (hieros/hieron) for some kind of Nymphs and of Achelous; and again, if you wish, the good breath (eupnous) of the place, how sufficient (agapeton) and violently pleasurable (sphodros hedu) it is; summery and clear, it responds to the chorus of cicadas; and most subtle (kompsos) of all is the grass, that it has grown (phuein) in gently to the steep slope, sufficient to hold, for one who has laid down their head, altogether beautifully

    so it has been the best stranger guide for you, O beloved Phaedrus

    // 230β - 230ξ

    Socrates: so it has been the best stranger guide for you, O beloved Phaedrus

    // 230ξ

    ὥστε ἄριστά σοι ἐξενάγηται, ὦ φίλε Φαῖδρε

    //

    Socrates: (cont.) that it has grown (phuein) in gently to the steep slope, sufficient to hold, for one who has laid down their head, altogether beautifully

    // 230ξ

    ὅτι ἐν ἠρέμα προσάντει ἱκανὴ πέφυκε κατακλινέντι τὴν κεφαλὴν παγκάλως ἔχειν

    //

    of all
    the most subtle
    that of the grass
    that in gently
    to the steep
    sufficient has grown
    for one who laid down their head
    altogether beautifully
    to hold

    //

    Socrates: (cont.) and most subtle (kompsos) of all is the grass

    // 230ξ

    πάντων δὲ κομψότατον τὸ τῆς πόας

    //

    Socrates: (cont.) summery and clear, it responds to the chorus of cicadas

    // 230ξ

    θερινόν τε καὶ λιγυρὸν ὑπηχεῖ τῷ τῶν τεττίγων χορῷ

    //

    Socrates: (cont.) and again, if you wish, the good breath (eupnous) of the place, how sufficiently amicable (agapeton) and violently pleasurable (sphodros hedu) it is

    // 230ξ

    εἰ δ᾽ αὖ βούλει, τὸ εὔπνουν τοῦ τόπου ὡς ἀγαπητὸν καὶ σφόδρα ἡδύ

    //

    This resists translation and contains a noetic pleasure puzzle.

    Eu + pnous, literally good breath, figuratively good breeze, seems to be a pun or wordplay on eu + nous, which would mean good intellect. The other two predicates — agapeton and sphodros hedu — are a pair of nearly conflicting pleasures. Agapeton describes a moderate and measured affection, whereas sphodros hedu describes a kind of pleasure (intense, vehement, violent) that lacks measure and is infinite; see Philebus 52c.

    The hint is that the place itself (tou topou) possesses something akin to intelligence, or something akin to a soul, which can provide both finite and infinite pleasures, and perhaps inspires both finite and infinite love or desire. But only, he specifies, if you wish.

    //

    Socrates: (cont.) and by the girls and the statues it seems to be the temple (hieron) for some kind of Nymphs and of Achelous

    // 230β

    Νυμφῶν τέ τινων καὶ Ἀχελῴου ἱερὸν ἀπὸ τῶν κορῶν τε καὶ ἀγαλμάτων ἔοικεν εἶναι

    //

    Hieron can be read as temple/holy place and as victim/sacrifical offering. Achelous was a shape-shifting river god.

    //

    Socrates: (cont.) by the witness (tekmairomai) of my foot

    // 230β

    ὥστε γε τῷ ποδὶ τεκμήρασθαι

    //

    Socrates: (cont.) and again the graceful stream is flowing under the platanos tree with exceedingly cool water

    // 230β

    ἥ τε αὖ πηγὴ χαριεστάτη ὑπὸ τῆς πλατάνου ῥεῖ μάλα ψυχροῦ ὕδατος

    //

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